miracles do they happen??

[Alan McDougall]

Hi there are previous threads along this line of thought but posed as statements instead of questions

I post this thread in the uncategorised forum because miracles in my opinion, are not restricted to religion

I would like to ask the forum if they have ever come accross a true miracle in their lives?

A miracle as defined by the Catholic Church, is an Instant healing and recovery, documented by at least three doctors, with the healing/miracle being unexplainable by medical science, instantaneous and life long

I have seen just one event I would call a miracle in my life, namely the almost instantaneous healing of a young boy with the most virulent form of leukaemia (my friend Anthony;s child) He was fifteen when he was diagnosed with this awful cancer and is now fourty years of age and in perfect health

[kennethamy]

Originally Posted by Alan McDougall

Hi there are previous threads along this line of thought but posed as statements instead of questions

I post this thread in the uncategorised forum because miracles in my opinion, are not restricted to religion

I would like to ask the forum if they have ever come accross a true miracle in their lives?

A miracle as defined by the Catholic Church, is an Instant healing and recovery, documented by at least three doctors, with the healing/miracle being unexplainable by medical science, instantaneous and life long

I have seen just one event I would call a miracle in my life, namely the almost instantaneous healing of a young boy with the most virulent form of leukaemia (my friend Anthony;s child) He was fifteen when he was diagnosed with this awful cancer and is now fourty years of age and in perfect health

Yes, there are some reports of spontaneous remissions. There is much about some cancers we do not know. By the way, not all supposed miracles are medical miracles. For instance, the parting of the Red Sea.

[xris]

I get the feeling when miracles are mentioned certain individuals have been selected to receive preferential treatment. I then have to ask why they should receive it and others do not? If miracles are some type of selection process how do we know how to get selected, its all a bit bizarre to me.

[Khethil]

Recoveries "being unexplainable by medical science". Oh heck yea. They can't explain most diagnosis anyway (except, perhaps, a severed arm - and then only if the victim beat the doctor over the head with it). So on the flip side - unexplained recoveries. I'd bet they happen all the time! So much we don't know...

It would only be the other criteria of your definition (documentation, witnessing, etc.) which would - I'd guess - make the whole event relatively rare.

Good thread.

[Zetherin]

Originally Posted by Alan McDougall

A miracle as defined by the Catholic Church, is an Instant healing and recovery, documented by at least three doctors, with the healing/miracle being unexplainable by medical science, instantaneous and life long

This is all a miracle is? Bodily healing unexplained by current medical science? Well then, I suppose miracles happens all the time!

[hue-man]

Miracles are really lame nowadays. What happened to a man turning a sea blood red with his wooden stick, frogs falling from the sky, or men walking on water and rising from the dead?

[kennethamy]

Originally Posted by Zetherin

This is all a miracle is? Bodily healing unexplained by current medical science? Well then, I suppose miracles happens all the time!

That is not what a miracle is. What you mean is that what are believed to be miracles are (as yet) unexplained natural events, and that there are no miracles.

The classic essay is, "Of Miracles" by David Hume who argues not that there are no miracles, but that we cannot know that there are because there must always be more reason to believe that an event is an unexplained natural event, than there can be reason to believe it is a miracle.

Here is the famous essay: Worth reading.

"Of Miracles" - David Hume

[Zetherin]

Originally Posted by kennethamy

The classic essay is, "Of Miracles" by David Hume who argues not that there are no miracles, but that we cannot know that there are because there must always be more reason to believe that an event is an unexplained natural event, than there can be reason to believe it is a miracle.

I thought an unexplained natural event was a miracle. There's a distinction? I suppose there's one from some religious/supernatural point-of-view, huh?

[kennethamy]

Originally Posted by Zetherin

I thought an unexplained natural event was a miracle. There's a distinction? I suppose there's one from some religious/supernatural point-of-view, huh?

Of course there is. Miracles are violations of the laws of nature which are divine interventions. That you do not believe there are any such things doesn't mean that if they existed they would not be different from just unexplained events. I don't believe there are unicorns either, but I think that if there were any they would not just be horses. (Hume also distinguishes between the miraculous and the marvelous. Penicillin, when first discovered, was not miraculous, but it was marvelous).

[prothero]

Certainly highly unusual, rare and unexpected events occur.
The spontaneous remission of certain cancers is a well documented phenomena.
That does not mean they were "miracles" using the traditional religious notion of a miracle as a divine intervention contravening natural law.
Nature does not appear to be deterministic and some events have a very low probability of occuring but if they did occur (spontaneous combustion say) they still would not be miracles only extremely rare events.