Traditional Ethnic or World Music

[Samm]

Originally Posted by Lily

Well, eh, here I am. It's been a while, but time flies, so I'll answer anyway. I'm not very good at old scandinavian songs, lousy to be honest, and my first thought is the music from Ronja Rövardotter,( what is her name in english?)

P.s never heard of kulning before.

Hi, Lily!... Hi, Lily! Hi, Lo! (Sorry. Once you get those old tunes started, it's hard to stop! ) In case you don't know what tune I'm referring to, here's a clip from the movie ("Lili")...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLzGtDh0DfI

I'm Samm, melonkali's husband, and she asked me to get the kulning video to you, as she is under the weather. An odd little saying that, "under the weather," as if any of us were above it. So here we go with kulning, part one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2DIdfIe5MY

I am told that the Japanese are big fans of kulning. Uh huh. They probably think its a long lost Kubuki masterpiece. But then, kulning more closely resembles music.

Samm

[melonkali]

Wow, I've just been catching up on all this wonderful music. What a magnificent variety of sounds and rhythms.

The first nordic song Lily posted sounded like the description the "ethnomusicologists" apply to old pre-Christian norse -- I know zip about more modern norse folk, and was glad to learn more.

The Sufi (?) sounds by Salima seem to me akin to the "acquired" taste I've developed for the true-Georgian-scale less-Western-consonant Georgian music. I couldn't have started there, but now it's my favorite sound.

I love those Greek rhythms, never heard them before. And of course those lovely Belgian ladies -- though I must admit I preferred that sailor-ish song in its French version.

Samm it seems prefers simplicity, probably like Xris?

I was glad Samm mentioned the Georgian "community singing" style helping the street children there -- full-participatory singing of traditional songs is really a "glue" that's held Georgian culture together for centuries, perhaps millenia. There are Youtube vids showing even modern teenage Georgians out in a restaurant suddenly breaking into traditional song and dance, with some occasional old fat guy occasionally jumping in,and everyone else in the restaurant clapping along.

I'll end with a favorite silly 1:28 mn video showing a couple of Georgian teenage boys out on a frozen lake, goofing around, and by 40 seconds into the vid they've started clowning around singing AND trying to perform the correct dance steps, on the slippery ice, to the well known Shina Vorgil round dance. Sure it's dumb, but the heritage lives on...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVN8a0EU-fM

Rebecca

[salima]

so i guess no one appreciates nusrat. that is understandable actually, because it is music from another world, not this one! outside the bounds of space and time, unbound by any rules of meter or rhyme...what was i thinking anyway?!

[Catchabula]

Salima, there is our personal appreciation and there is the real greatness of an artist. I personally don't like Mozart and Beethoven, but of course I will not deny their real "objective" greatness. If I say "I don't like..." I say nothing more or less than that, it's probably only stating that I'm not there yet. But I have the right to say it, no? As well as I have a duty to listen to what I don't like, and with an open mind, to find out if I like it or not. Honesty is not prejudice...

[salima]

Originally Posted by Catchabula

Salima, there is our personal appreciation and there is the real greatness of an artist. I personally don't like Mozart and Beethoven, but of course I will not deny their real "objective" greatness. If I say "I don't like..." I say nothing more or less than that, it's probably only stating that I'm not there yet. But I have the right to say it, no? As well as I have a duty to listen to what I don't like, and with an open mind, to find out if I like it or not. Honesty is not prejudice...

agreed. i also dont care for mozart or beethoven. or chopin, he was the worst in my opinion. and i deny there being any objective greatness in art!

[melonkali]

Salima,

I must beg your patience, Salima -- some of us have to take the slow lane. My statement about Nusrat being an "acquired taste", I can see in retrospect, sounded like I was being dismissive. I should have been clearer that while I had a learning process to undergo, I was prepared to begin the journey.

I know ZIP about Qawwali music, and don't have your natural intuition for it, so I'm working at it in baby steps at Youtube. I've been over at Youtube, listening and reading the comments -- someone's uploaded a multipart documentary on Nusrat called "Voice of Heaven".

I'm beginning to "get" some of what several commentors (at Youtube) consider Nusrat's lesser works, umm... Mahya Pardesi Ho Gaya(?) and some of the songs called Raaga (?) and a popular number Tere Bin from a feature film, I think?

It may take a while for me to work up to a higher level of understanding, if indeed I ever can, but clearly "something's there", and I'm closer to it today than I was yesterday. So thank you, and I apologize for the misunderstanding.

I'm also at Youtube listening to the very first (turn of the 20th century) recordings of authentic Georgian music before it became a little more Western-consonant for the concert stage. I LOVE the dissonant sound and crave more -- but I wouldn't have felt that way a year ago. I seem bound to perpetually travel the slow lane...

rebecca

[Catchabula]

Hi everybody. I think it is important to learn the "general theory" behind certain forms of music. Western music is probably more individual and "subjective". There's no "official intention", here's my tune and you can do with it as you please, and if you see God in it that's your interpretation, another perception could be different and but is equally valuable. Like most westerners who hear it the first time I experienced Nusrat's music as just "very indian", stimulating my imagination, evoking images of turbaned crowds in the spicy smelling streets of Calcutta or Bombay (I imagine Salima smiling... ). I also have to learn more about Sufi music, and its intention may be very consistent with my personal experience and conception of music, being a revelation and an expression of the Divine. As to raga's don't they have to be performed at a certain hour of the day? Fascinating idea, but what could be the explanation? I could invent a few explanations myself, but perhaps there is one that is "generally accepted"? But all this is just theory. Let's have some music. This is a short clip from a hypnotising sound...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DC9w4KWEgJE&feature=fvw

[salima]

hi melon-
no problem, and i appreciate your taking the time to mention it.

i dont think it is a requisite that we must all learn to appreciate everything-there isnt enough time in one life to do that anyway! usually nusrat either appeals to someone instantly or he doesnt. but those whom he reaches become devotees in a sense, and comrades across world cultures. my best friends in the world are that because of this common thread in our lives. sounds silly, and maybe it is. it is amazing to me when i come across a fan of his because you would never suspect who they might be-young and old, educated and un, rich and poor, any country and language-but finding that common denominator, all other differences become meaningless. actually it isnt even something that belongs in a music discussion because it is more of a meditation or mind-altering method. so when i listen, i dont do something else while i am listening, i only listen. and i wouldnt play it for anyone else unless i was deeply into beginning a serious relationship...it isnt just something to leave in the background.

i used to play it at work, sometimes the same song over and over the entire day, and at first i thought it would be disrespectful not to give all my attention to the music, and that i would become annoyed having to stop and answer the telephone when customers called. but instead, what happened was that i was able to give 100% attention to the music, and some other extra mechanical part of me did my work. my fingers used to fly across the keyboard, and people would hear the sound and come and stand and watch me. i found it effortless to come down and answer the phone and have my thoughts grounded and then return to where i left off. i became virtually flawless in my typing and decision making, and when the day was over i couldnt even remember what i had done.

catch-i love the didgeridoo by the way, that was something that instantly appealed to me. and remind me, when you get your computer back and email going i will send you a picture of me i call 'nusrat eyes' which i took while i was off in the ozone at work. i still cant believe it is me...

[gautamssgk]

HI UR talks r meningful and i appreciate the same

[melonkali]

Salima, I agree there's not enough time for anyone to learn to appreciate all types of music, that we all have favored sounds which almost instantly evoke a strong, intuitive response in our hearts and souls. We hear other sounds which immediately create such a strong negative reaction that we know there's "no hope" for us down that path.

On the other hand, when someone like Nusrat has a huge international following of devotees from many different backgrounds, there's a part of me that longs to hear and feel and somehow "understand" the special enchantment which is obviously there.

I have an MP3 album -- YoYo Ma, Mark O'Connor and Edgar Meyer -- which I've been trying to "get" for two years now. Why? Because the customer reviews (at Amazon) which prompted me to buy it were filled with genuine passion from people moved by an almost other-worldly beauty. One gentleman related that on first hearing, he had to pull his car over to the side of the road because he was sobbing uncontrollably. I still cannot hear what they heard, but I keep trying because I continue hoping that if I ever "get it", then perhaps I, too, may share in this music's unique, intense flavor of magic.

Catch, who can resist a didgeridoo? It must be a universal phenomenon. I'll use your post as an excuse to segue from the sublime to the ridiculous (which carries its own kind of magic), an absurd, shocking yet wonderful moment in musical cinema history. Unfortunately you can't hear the didgeridoo sound as clearly (in this Youtube video) as we first heard it onscreen when the entire audience "en masse" dropped our jaws (and our popcorn).

For those unfamiliar, the movie is "The Adventures of Priscilla, Queen of the Desert", shot in 25-days by an independent Australian film company, using a then-unknown cast almost literally picked off the streets. The following scene begins after three professional "drag show" performers, stranded in the Australian outback, have lucked upon a small group of aborigines.

I strongly suggest clicking on the url/http (at the very top of the video picture) which takes you to its Youtube site -- this particular video really needs the larger screen there.

You have to listen hard for the didgeridoo (which comes in about the middle of the song), but it's worth it. Don't overlook those now-famous "footless" costume-pants. Can you spot Hugo Weaving (later famed as elf-king Elrond in LOTR) and Guy Pearce (The Count of Monte Cristo)? Perhaps they'd both prefer you didn't...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DJC-ECU8IE

rebecca