Traditional Ethnic or World Music

[Catchabula]

That's sheer poetry Samm, or at least that's how it was felt by my saliva glands. But mossioeu, hush puppies with the dish? Puppies are young doggies no? And is all this swallowed without the right amount of diluted and aromated C2H5OH ? And creole, isn't that the Deep South too? Dying for an explanation here.

[Samm]

Originally Posted by Catchabula

That's sheer poetry Samm, or at least that's how it was felt by my saliva glands. But mossioeu, hush puppies with the dish? Puppies are young doggies no? And is all this swallowed without the right amount of diluted and aromated C2H5OH ? And creole, isn't that the Deep South too? Dying for an explanation here.

Yeah, I guess that shoulda been hushpuppies, which you probably know are deep fried cornbready balls with onions. No, you'd be surprised at the number of teetotallers (non-drinkers) in the south, especially at those Church functions. And where you find drinking, here in the land of Jack Daniels (holy be his name), its mostly beer. (But being a non-drinker myself--mostly--I may not have an accurate image of things.) Louisiana is the home state of cajun and creole music and other works of art, culinary and otherwise. All the states from Virginia-Kentucky-Arkansas south are home to various varieties of Deep South Cookin'. I'm a Tennessean who dearly misses the four to six annual family reunion potlucks and singalongs my wider family always used to have when I was young. But the only strong drink we ever had at our reunions was homemade cider and blackberry wine. Creole is fine dining, but I don't know it well.

Samm

[salima]

Originally Posted by Catchabula

That's sheer poetry Samm, or at least that's how it was felt by my saliva glands. But mossioeu, hush puppies with the dish? Puppies are young doggies no? And is all this swallowed without the right amount of diluted and aromated C2H5OH ? And creole, isn't that the Deep South too? Dying for an explanation here.

if i remember right, creole means the same as arcadian-the people who came from france and settled in canada and for whatever reason (i forgot) moved to the deep south and are centered in louisiana. there is the area they call the french quarter, and the grand festival of mardi gras which you surely must know. louisiana was the only place in america i would have liked to see-i think there must be no place like it on the entire earth, as far as the geography and landscape and culture. mardi gras would be too much for me-but at any other time i would really love to go.

by the way samm, tennessee is truly beautiful. on the way home from fort benning to the great lakes we drove through it-the country in georgia is all dust and red clay and scrub things growing, or trying to. but suddenly, crossing the border into tennessee we re-enter the world. the trees, the mountains, and all that which inspired music and poems in the 'new' world.

[Samm]

I may be wrong but I think there is a difference between cajun and creole. The creole culture is a black French Caribbean culture from the islands like Haiti in the Gulf. The French Canadians to which you referred occupied the Arcadian region of Canada before they were, I think, forced to migrate out of Canada and came eventually to make a new home in Louisiana. It was there that the Arcadians, as they were known, became the ar'cajuns, and finally the cajuns. There's been some 200 odd years of interaction between creoles and cajuns in the wetlands of the Mississippi delta and especially "the Big Easy" as New Orleans is called. And yeah, its a special and unique place without another of its kind in the whole country. I love their dialects as well as their spicey cuisine, and of course their music is as unique as the people themselves.

Samm

[salima]

Originally Posted by Samm

I may be wrong but I think there is a difference between cajun and creole. The creole culture is a black French Caribbean culture from the islands like Haiti in the Gulf. The French Canadians to which you referred occupied the Arcadian region of Canada before they were, I think, forced to migrate out of Canada and came eventually to make a new home in Louisiana. It was there that the Arcadians, as they were known, became the ar'cajuns, and finally the cajuns. There's been some 200 odd years of interaction between creoles and cajuns in the wetlands of the Mississippi delta and especially "the Big Easy" as New Orleans is called. And yeah, its a special and unique place without another of its kind in the whole country. I love their dialects as well as their spicey cuisine, and of course their music is as unique as the people themselves.

Samm

so how did black people get to haiti in the first place? i am a little short on history. why did they come to louisiana? and was that where they first mixed with the french culture?

[Samm]

I would have answered that the black people came as slaves from Africa via one route or another, but I defer to this Wikipedia link that will provide more detailed info. (Its more or less accurate but better researched than what I could provide.)

Louisiana Creole people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I hope this helps.

Samm

[melonkali]

A potpourri post -- sorry I've been away for a few days.

Salima,

I didn't know about your dialup download problem. Your videos played very well -- thanks. I do agree with you on a "too polished" production of traditional music.

Are you able to download/listen to simple streaming audio without too much frustration? If so, please advise -- I know a few good sites for that.

A SAD TRADITIONAL-STYLE SONG OF THE AMERICAN CIVIL WAR

Although this was recently written by Elvis Costello for the movie Cold Mountain, a tragic story set during American Civil War, it done in old-timey traditional style and beautifully sung by Alison Krauss. I'll post the lyrics first, then the link.

The Scarlet Tide

VERSE ONE:
Well I recall his parting words,
Must I accept his fate, or take myself far from this place?
I thought I heard a black bell toll.
A little bird did sing.
Man has no choice when he wants everything.

CHORUS:
We'll rise above The Scarlet Tide
That trickles down through the mountains
And separates the widow from the bride.

VERSE TWO:
Man goes beyond his own decision,
Gets caught up in the mechanism
Of swindlers who act like kings,
And brokers who break everything.
The dark of night was softly fading,
Close to the dawn of day.
Why would I want him, just to lose him again?
REPEAT CHORUS.

YouTube - Alison Krauss - The scarlet tide

SOUTHERN FOOD AND CAJUN SONGS

While searching for Southern traditional-music/bluegrass singer Tim O'Brien's song "Cornbread Nation", I came across:

This Cajun song sung in both French and English by Tim O'Brien and Courtney Granger, nephew of Christine Balfa (daughter of the founder of Cajun band Balfa Toujours?), who is married to Dirk Powell, a close collaborator of Tim's. First lyrics, then link.

Deux Voyages

Ils sont partis du pays pour faire un grande voyage
Ils ont traverse la mer avec juste leur courage
Mas pfres ont laisse tout pour la liberte
Il y avait pas un roi qui pouvait les enchainer

They left their land behind to make a great journey
With nothing but their music, their courage and their names
Our fathers sailed the sea to the west seeking freedom
There never was a king that could keep them in chains

I went back across the sea to find where I came from
To the land of my fathers, to their own little town
Such a beautiful place, I'll never know how they left it
But they gave it up for me and the new life they found

J'ai traverse la mer pour rechercher mon heritage
Dans le pays de mes pfres, leur petit village
Comment ils ont guitte cette belle place,
Je peux pas comprende Ils ont risque tout ils avaient pour leurs decendants

YouTube - French & English - Tim O'Brien - Two Journeys (Deux Voyages)

AND FINALLY, while still searching for Tim O'Brien's "Cornbread Nation", I found this gem:

A little history: Tim O'Brien is a not-very-famous artist, but among American traditional music enthusiasts, he is a god. He is a "traditional purist" and a musician's musician who plays several instruments and sings harmony on many albums by better known artists.

Before producing his album "The Crossing", a hybrid of Irish and American Appalachian traditional music (which was largely based on Irish and Scot music), Tim stayed in Ireland for a considerable time to REALLY learn Irish music. The list of musicians who accompany Tim on "The Crossing" album reads like a "who's who" of some of the finest musicians on both sides of the Atlantic.

Probably due (in part) to the above Irish adventure, I found a video I'd never heard of before -- and this one is a must-see!!

Tim O'Brien, The Chieftans and even some Riverdancers performing the old-timey traditional American Appalachian tune Shady Grove.

YouTube - the chieftains & tim o'brien - shady grove

Oh, and about Southern cooking. I would not recommend trying to make our famous "shoo fly pie" (cane molasses pie). I tried it once. I looked in the oven, everything was fine, dark molasses bubbling in a pie crust. I opened the oven 10 minutes later to find a completely empty pie crust. It took DAYS, not mere hours, to clean all the molasses from every part of that oven.

rebecca

[salima]

sweet potato pie is fabulous, though! and sweet potato pancakes...

no, i cant watch streaming audio or podcasts or anything like that. maybe some day...
bluegrass is also good, i was going to look for one for this thread, but i think i will go find a nusrat. the problem is they are 25-40 minutes long and most people wont listen to the whole thing. he has done some short ones, but they arent as good-it is like having a six minute quickie. qawwali needs time to build and time for the listener to imbibe and react.

[melonkali]

Ooops! My original Georgian Legend vid is apparently no longer available.

HOWEVER, there is still another version of it on Youtube, so I'll link it here and see what happens.

Reminder: The concert group Georgian Legend produced this video to the powerful song "Shatilis Asulo" to specifically give Westerners a "feel" for the Republic of Georgia. GA Legend is one of the rare Georgian concert groups which uses Western instruments. Let's see if this link works.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bu9Z4rqH0A

rebecca

[melonkali]

I'd originally mentioned the difference in Finnish (Karelian) music and Nordic/Norse music. There is some Norse traditional music in the very Western part of Finland where the Swedes settled (and still largely speak Swedish). Since I did post some Finnish Karelian music, I went searching for authentic Norse traditional music.

Authentic music was hard for me to find, in light of the new Viking Death Metal movement (UGH!!) plus the history that around 1500-1600 the big three Norse nations (Sweden, Norway, Denmark) were heavily influenced by European court music. The traditional Nordic music tradition has survived somewhat in the Faroe Islands (where?) and Iceland.

The first group is Voces Thules, a classically traditionally trained Icelandic group. WARNING: Their music can be quite dark, but well performed. The second group, Gjallarhorn, is more enjoyable, IMO.

THREE SONGS BY VOCES THULES

1. Song: Olafur Liljuros, found both in Iceland and the Faroe Islands. Below are the Iceland lyrics. Essentially a knight/prince (Olaf) rides through the woods, gets seduced by elf maiden, he starts to kiss her and she whacks him in the chest with her axe. In Christianized versions, he rejects her for God, but still grants her a parting kiss and WHACK!

This represents, I believe, the kind of ballad traditionally used for round dancing in Nordic countries...

Olafur Liljuros

Olafur reið með björgum fram,
Villir hann, stillir hann.
Hitti hann fyrir sjer alfarann;
Þar rauður loginn brann.
Bliðan lagði byrinn undan björgunum,
Bliðan lagði byrinn undan björgunum fram.

þa kom ut ein alfamær,
Villir hann, stillir hann.
Hun var ekki Kristi kær;
Þar rauður login brann.

Bliðan lagði byrinn undan björgunum,
Bliðan lagði byrinn undan björgunum fram.

Vendi jeg minu kvæði i kross.
Villir hann, stillir hann.
Sankta Maria sje með oss,
Þar rauður login brann.

Bliðan lagði byrinn undan björgunum

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcb1bAM9uss

2. Again by Voces Thules -- Trollaslagur (Troll's Fight?) -- note the parallel 5th's and 4th's in the vocal harmony (that and the "organum" and the "darker" often minor sounds are supposedly indicative of old Norse music)

Trollaslagur

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OH9OFHp3Xdk

3. The final song by Voces Thules -- Kummavisur, The Raven -- I'll post the Iceland lyrics and rough English translation (which I believe was posted verses backward at Youtube)

Krummavisur

Krummi svaf í kletta gjá, -
kaldri vetrar nóttu á,
verður margt að meini;
fyrr en dagur fagur rann
freðið nefið dregur hann
undan stórum steini.

Allt er frosið úti gor,
ekkert fæst við ströndu mor,
svengd er metti mína;
ef að húsum heim ég fer,
heimafrakkur bannar mér
seppi´ úr sorpi´ að tína.

Öll er þakin ísi jörð,
ekki séð á holta börð
fleygir fuglar geta;
en þó leiti út um mó,
auða hvergi lítur tó;
hvað á hrafn að éta?

Sálaður á síðu lá
sauður feitur garði hjá,
fyrrum frár á velli.
---------------------------------
It is very difficult to translate this, because you have to know more about poems than translations, you have to understand the poem before you translate, otherwise the translation will sound horrible.?

+2
3: The earth is covered in ice
You can't? see the ground at all
Full-fledged birds are capable of
Full-fledged birds are capable of
But even though I look everywhere
There's just one color
What can a raven eat
What can a raven eat?
Huldumavur (4 weeks ago) Show Hide
+2
2: Everything is frozen outside
You can't get anything at the beach
I'm so hungry
I'm so hungry
If I go to a house
The dog forbids me
To eat from the garbage
Eat from the garbage

The raven slept in a? rock-rift
The raven slept in a rock-rift
Huldumavur (4 weeks ago) Show Hide
+2
1: The raven? slept in a rock-rift
On a cold winters night
There are many things that can hurt him
Many things that can hurt him
Before a beautiful day cameHe pulls his frozen nose
From underneath a big rock
Underneath a big rock

The raven slept in a rock-rift
The raven slept in a rock-rift

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXXXdf-a6LI

NOW A LIGHTER GROUP: GJALLARHORN
Gjallarhorn is actually from the Western (Swedish) part of Finland but they live in Sweden. Gjallarhorn is known for its use of the Australian Digeridoo(sp?), but iT works well substitute for the long horns used in olden days as drone instruments.

GJALLARHORN TWO SONGS

1. "i riden sa" (ye ride so carefully) -- note the delicate dulcimer, an old Norse instrument, and the occasionally harmony supposedly typical of the Norse. First Swedish lyrics, then English translation.

i riden sa

A Silibrand körde uppa höga loftessvala
Allt under den linden sa gröna
Där fick han se sin dotter i lunden fara
I riden sa varliga genom lunden med henne

A välest mej välest mej vad jag nu ser
Jag ser min dotter hon kommer til mej
A Silibrand fämnar ut kap-pan sa bla

Där föder hon tva kar=ska svenbarnen pa
Min fader skall jag giva min gan-gare gra
Som han skall rida till kyrkan uppa

Min syster skall jag giva mina guld-ringar sju
Som jag ej haft sen jag stod brud
Min broder skall jag giva mina hand-skar sma

Som han skall ha lik-vart han gar
Den ene sa för dom till Fre-jas dop
Den andre sa för dom till Vallhalla sal
---------------------------------------- ---------
O, Silibrant went up to the high loft
All under the green linden tree
There he saw his daughter going to the grove
Ye ride so carefully through the grove with her

O, woe is me, woe is me, what do I behold
I see my daughter coming to me

O, Silibrant spread out his cloak so blue
And upon it she did bear two bold baby boys

I shall give my father my grey steed
So he can ride to the church upon it

I shall give my sister my seven golden rings
That I have never worn since I am a bribe

I shall give my brother my small gloves
That he shall take with him wherever he goeth

One child they took to Freya's baptism
The other they took to the hall of Valhalla

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBV5SSbQh5o

2. Final song by Gjallarhorn -- and instrumental "Oravais Minuet" -- although the minuet was a European import, the battle drums and heavy fiddle syle and digeridoo drone give it that Nordic sound, IMO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8dRY3rhr9c

I'm still just learning about Nordic music, and would appreciate any and all help!

rebecca