Creationism works, Atheism does not

[BrightNoon]

Good God, only someone certain of eternal life would waste time in this manner.


If you believe the basic tennets of theology, that life after death is the reward of good people, then we will live in a good world.

What is good? There are various and contradictory answers.

If you accept that your death is the end of you, then you have no reason at all to not destroy everything in a crass attempt to live just a little bit longer.

Yes, the atheist has no obligation to act in a 'moral' fashion, though he may. In my experience, most do. Note: I personally, raise no objection to crass destrution for selfish purposes, though I would do such things not to live longer, but to live better.

Seeing as though, very roughly speaking, our world (mostly) does advance, and our lives do improve, due to the goodness of others, one can only conclude that Creationism is better than Atheism, regardless of which is true or not.

1) I see no reason to believe that 'our lives improve due to the goodness of others.' Modern prosperity is rather the cumulative effect of selfishness: capitalism.
2) Even if that were the case, what do you mean by better: survival of the species? That is not good, only desireable: to most anyhow.

And seeing as though creationism is functional, whereas atheism is dysfunctional, we can only conclude that Creationism is THE TRUTH.

1) Belief in creationism, belief in God, is not necessarily better for the species, as I said above. Even if it were, survival of the species is not somehow, in a general sense, better than its demise. Functionality is not better than dysfuntionality.
2) Even if beleif in God made the world better, in some universal moral sense, which it does not, and whih universal moral sense does not exist, that still does not prove that the doctrine of creationism is true. A belief can be essential for survival and still be false.

[Khethil]

Well, it's all good. We have our own views I suppose.

I do wish this wasn't so vitriolic an issue
I really wish such an abysmal rift didn't short-circuit sharing
And I hope for more opportunities to share and debate in a context that's absent of mean-spirited judgments.

I'll always work to kill prejudicial judgment because I think it injures us all; but it's such a fine line. By refuting hatefulness, often times folk become even more rancorous and the cycle refreshes anew; snowballing and feeding on itself. Suddenly, ones brought to a realization that even by engaging with honest and courteous talk; mixed with sincere concessions, the fire still burns and swells.

I suppose one can only do so much to bring divergent views together, but I ain't giving up

Cheers!

[boagie]

YO!

One must ask themself, would I rather live happily within an illusion, or unhappily perhaps with stark reality, does truth have any survival value, does intellectual intrigity have any value. The cost of delusion might prove to high ---for some!

[Trevor_C]

Originally posted by Poseidon.

If you believe the basic tennets of theology, that life after death is the reward of good people, then we will live in a good world.

All of my life I have been hearing quotes similar to this one. Do you really think that a person needs to believe in theology to live a good life and live in a good world? I am an atheist, and have been all of my life. I consider myself to be a good person, and Australia where I live is mostly secular going by the last count, and I cannot think of a better place I would rather live. And no! I promise you that I will not run a muck and try to destroy the world because I do not believe in life after death.

[TickTockMan]

Maybe if we all just got together and sang . . . where's my guitar . . . okay, and-a-one, and-a-two:

"Michael row your boat ashore, Hallelujah! Come on, everybody! Michael row your boat ashore, Halleluuuuuuujah . . . anybody? No?"

(slinks away, vaguely embarrassed by his sarcasm and lack of a helpful contribution)

[Theaetetus]

The thing I do not get in all of this, is that this whole thread makes no sense. The basis of creationism works, atheism does not has fundamental concepts out of whack. Creationism and atheism are not mutually exclusive, nor jointly exhaustive ideas. Creationism is the idea that a creator god created everything. You can believe in god but not believe that the god created the universe. Many god believers would probably be insulted to be falsely classified as atheists by virtue of not believing in the tenets of creationism.

[ali_jamieson]

That's like the Ontological argument [which IMHO is bull****]. I think there are a few assumptions and there's an example of a slippery slope argument.

Originally Posted by Poseidon

If you believe the basic tennets [sic] of theology, that life after death is the reward of good people, then we will live in a good world.

Okay, accepted, however how do you determine good and bad? Moral absolutism has to kind of be pre-excepted for this.

Originally Posted by Poseidon

If you accept that your death is the end of you, then you have no reason at all to not destroy everything in a crass attempt to live just a little bit longer.

Yes you have no reason, but also no drive. This also assumes the premise that we live in a dog-eat-dog world and that in order to survive longer, we *have* to destroy...

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Seeing as though, very roughly speaking, our world (mostly) does advance, and our lives do improve, due to the goodness of others, one can only conclude that Creationism is better than Atheism, regardless of which is true or not.

Weather or not your life does/does not advance I still don't see how this would make Creationism any more viable? It might make it a better option, or more a wishful think approach, but this lacks substance.

Originally Posted by Poseidon

And seeing as though creationism is functional, whereas atheism is dysfunctional, we can only conclude that Creationism is THE TRUTH.

This assumed LIFE is functional, in-which I would debate off topic.

From other posts:

Originally Posted by Poseidon

...and perhaps even more who've committed evil in the name of their theology. Now, there are a great many good, decent, productive and loving theists...

Exactly, not wanting to get into it, but most every religion discriminates against something which we basically accept [secularists, homosexuals, women etc] because we are sentient 21st Century non-idiots. So many creeds are stuck in the dark ages, and actually halt the development of society and the human-race as a whole [ethically speaking].

I think religion was needed to start a set of morale codes, give people and example and a primitive meaning for 'it all'... but it needs to be re-assesed. I am not religious, but I am agnostic in my approach to 'greater being', however, Creationism has never done it for me.

Ali

[Aedes]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

If you believe the basic tennets of theology... one can only conclude that Creationism is better than Atheism

That seems self-evident. But keep in mind that your conclusion is contingent upon someone having a preexisting theism.

[Didymos Thomas]

Doesn't seem self evident to me. Depends on who's theology we're talking about.

[Aedes]

Just because theology can be diverse, in certain conversational contexts it is pretty obvious that common Christian ideas are the reference..