Do humans actually have free will?

[PeterDamian]

Determinism seems to breach the so called free will because all things you do have been theologically determined by the supreme being. If determinism have all humans programmed like a computer operator does with computers, what happens to free will?

The is no doubt in all aspects, some people even think that all man's action is determined by his environment.

What is free will?

[Mr. Fight the Power]

I like copying and pasting my posts from other forums, so here you go:


Value can only be built upon values, for we only accept values after we have judged them favorably, and that process of judging is not possible without a set of values to operate as a yardstick. By extension of this logic, we must conclude that some values are innate, as without this core set of values, no other values would have been possible.

Now these values are the will, as will is our motivation to act, and we do not act for any other reason than value fulfillment.

Also, if we are to consider the concept of freedom, we will certainly establish it as a state of sovereignty, of self-control.

So, for there to exist a free will, it must be a motivation entirely controlled by the individual who possesses them, and as such must be a product of values over which the individual is sovereign.

With it being stated that there exists an innate set of values that are the root for all of our motivations, and that only those who control their motivations possess free will, we can define two possibilities, those who are self-creators and those who do not possess free will.

Since it is plain that no person is a self-creator, we can say that no person exists that possesses a free will.

[mike9989]

Determinism is the logical conclusion of many scientists that believe in the cause and effect concept as it does support this.

The basic concept of determinism, in it's most primitive form is thus:
Every action or thought is the result of an action of thought previously applied, in other words, an action, like a butterfly fluttering it's wings can disturb the atmosphere and over a period of time this action completes a chain of events that cause a tornado (not actually proven but some atmospheric experts think that the slightest disturbance can unde correct circumstances cause a tornado!).

This is logically sound in that one action can lead to another etc, however, the suggestion that there is no free will on the part of humans, I believe to be a false presumption on our part, we choose freely what we eat for breakfast for instance, there can be parameters to our free choice, for example, there aren't any cornflakes! But one cannot deny that a choice between two breakfast cereals, say, cornflakes and Shredded wheat is completely free within the set parameters. So, I conclude that we are slaves of circumstance, but that our free choice within those circumstances is not restricted in any way.

[shindig284]

i really like where mike went on his post, but i must disagree. although in order to preserve our existance, there are certain parameters that we must follow, namely laws. however that does not mean that i cannot commit acts that would break the law if i chose to. if it was it was in my will to kill someone, i could do so. if it was in my will to steal, i could do so. there may be consequences to my actions if i were caught doing such things, but that doesn't mean that it in not within my free will to do so.

similarly, if i decided i wanted a type of breakfast cereal that i didn't have, then i could go to the store and buy some, or even steal some if i decided i wanted it bad enough and i had no money. or if i wanted a cereal that was not made, i could make such a cereal myself. or i could chose not to eat cereal at all, and could have pancakes or waffles for breakfast.

the possibilities for free will are infinate, not limited by anything, save maybe our conciousness.

[redzeppelin]

If we don't have free will, then we aren't responsible for anything we do - we can blame all manner of other things for our behavior.

[kennethamy]

Originally Posted by PeterDamian

Determinism seems to breach the so called free will because all things you do have been theologically determined by the supreme being. If determinism have all humans programmed like a computer operator does with computers, what happens to free will?

The is no doubt in all aspects, some people even think that all man's action is determined by his environment.

What is free will?

I always thought that doing something of one's own free will is doing something which you are not forced to do. When I had to eat oatmeal when I was a child because my mother made me do it, I was not eating oatmeal of my own free will. But now, when I eat oatmeal because I know it is good for me, and I want to eat oatmeal, then I am eating oatmeal of my own free will. Isn't that how you, yourself, talk when you are not thinking about philosophy?

[amid]

In fact, free will is nothing more than an illusion. People think that they posses free will. Why? Because they think free wil is a matter of choosing between two things.While we should remember that our present is determined by our past. In other words man is the slave of his genes and environment. he is not the master of his will. If free will is an agent independent of both environmental an genetic factors, you can do many things which are beyond you natural capability; you can even fly.

[Fido]

Originally Posted by PeterDamian

Determinism seems to breach the so called free will because all things you do have been theologically determined by the supreme being. If determinism have all humans programmed like a computer operator does with computers, what happens to free will?

The is no doubt in all aspects, some people even think that all man's action is determined by his environment.

What is free will?

Free will is no different from will unqualified. All life represents will. Do we have life, and do we have will; then we will against fate, against determinism, against the tyranny of time. All will is free.

[Aristoddler]

So then what is the difference between "free will" and "choice"?

[Fido]

Originally Posted by Aristoddler

So then what is the difference between "free will" and "choice"?

Will is love, or life force. Choice is like animation. If we can make a choice it proves their is a choice, and that our minds can discern between them so our minds are working which proves we still live. The only actual choice that tends to prove freedom of will is to escape from will, to deny ourselves, to deny our lives, to deny the value of our lives, and deny meaning to existence. For will must exist if it must often be denied, or defeated in other beings to have our lives. But proof aside, our existence supports will, Universal, undifferenciated will, and all will is free after the tremendous energy demanded by life is paid.